Re: UKNM: US Patents Office and e-commerece

[Jon Miller]

Paul Durrant wrote:

>Open Market has been granted US patents for:

>

>Secure real time online credit card payments

>Online shopping carts (basically lists of selected goods for purchase)

>Online session identifiers

>

>Does this mean if a Web design company in Europe creates a site for a

>client using the metaphor of a shopping cart into which you place selected goods and

>then pay by credit card online, that if used by US customers, that site

>is infringing the patent within the US?


Maybe this depends on where the transaction is 'located'  ... say a US

customer buys a CD from a UK-based Website, which is dispatched by air from

a UK fulfilment centre, surely this is not within a US patent? but what if

the CD is dispatched from a US based fulfilment centre - where does this

transaction happen exactly?? 


I see this list is doing ok for gurus in human-computer interaction, but is

there an expert on International Trade Law in the house ?!!!


I can't believe this patent will be allowed to stand. There's another

concerning US patent hidden in the mounds of CommerceNet News I received

recently, which I've pasted below - but here's the bit which worries me:


"[the patented technology] would be particularly useful in such ecommerce

applications as sending a phone bill over the Web so that users only need

to click the link to see the online version." 


We are currently developing exactly this functionality for a telecoms

company, but there are loads of other e-Commerce applications which would

be covered by such a patent. So do we need to worry about what happens in

the US?  And what is the US patent office playing at anyway? 


These kind of issues really highlight the need for industry-wide bodies to

such articulate concerns. There is of course the aforementioned

CommerceNet, who'll be lurking somewhere on this list (any thoughts??).

Also I was invited to something called the Digital Media Alliance earlier

this year, but I missed it and haven't heard anything since - anyone know

anything about this? 



Jon Miller


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Jon Miller 



www.omniscience.co.uk 

0171 588 3633

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Ecommerce breakthrough? Netdelivery gains patent for 'invited pull' 

========== 


A small Colorado company, Netdelivery, has been granted a patent by the US

Government that could have an impact on how information will be pushed and

delivered to users over the Internet. If Netdelivery succeeds in licensing

the patent to scores of so-called "push" vendors including Microsoft,

Netscape, Marimba and BackWeb, it would mean a windfall for the company,

which has begun to make inroads into the electronic bill-presentment 

marketplace. 



"If you take information from remote instructions using an URL like a

channel, you're directly on top of our patent," says Dave Ladouceur, chief

technology officer of Netdelivery. US patent 5,790,793 covers the method of

receiving information over the Internet via an URL that could be invoked

without user intervention. Such a technology would be particularly useful

in such ecommerce applications as sending a phone bill over the Web so that

users only need to click the link to see the online version. 


Netdelivery recently struck a deal with Canada Post and the Canadian Post

Office to develop an electronic post office, which will allow consumers 

and businesses in Canada the ability to view all mail online. Dick

Stranger, president of Netdelivery, estimates this project could be worth 

anywhere between $10 million and $50 million for his company. However, the

patent, which is described as "invited pull", could generate a lot more 

revenues in the form of licensing fees to Netdelivery, Ladouceur says. He

adds that his staff has identified 62 companies and their technologies, 

including Microsoft's Channel Definition Format and Netscape's Netcaster,

that may have infringed upon the patent. 


Microsoft and Netscape said they needed to study the Netdelivery patent

more closely before making any comment. A spokeswoman for BackWeb said its 

push technology is proprietary. A patent attorney representing Netdelivery,

says the firm has held informal discussion with some of these vendors to

see if they wanted to strike licensing deals. 


But Netdelivery is not the only one that is benefiting from such

technologies. Tibco, which holds a push technology patent that covers the 

delivery of information from peer to peer, has struck similar deals with

companies such as NationsBank and Nasdaq. (Via ZDNN)